Tuesday, October 9, 2007

Are you a total dork?


jkruse said...

Seems a lot less dorky to me than those douches with the gun on top of the suburban.

jroosh said...

True, but you must admit it was pretty funny.

jkruse said...

When I'm at work this late, I'm easily amused. So, OK.

Bike Bubba said...

I thought the "yes" was "are you willing to spend an extra five grand to save a few hundred bucks annually on gas?"

jkruse said...

...to save a few hundred bucks annually on gas?"

...and to be a good American by helping to reduce our dependence on foreign oil.

Bike Bubba said...

....or possibly actually increase our dependence, as creating and disposing of the motor and battery pack does not come for free, and the subsidies given to encourage people to buy hybrids come at the cost (partially) of keeping those who can't afford a hybrid in an older, gas guzzling vehicle.

Don't forget what Bastiat called "that which is unseen." Until people come up with a clear accounting of the energy and pollution cost of the hybrid power system, I don't think we can say it's a clear environmental win.

jkruse said...

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know. Priuses are way worse for the environment than hummers.


jroosh said...

Hummers are just as dorky as Priuses...probably more so.

Bike Bubba said...

Shouldn't we consider the question, Jkruse? How much toxic waste are we willing to generate to save a few gallons of gas? How many people do we keep in beaters so Arianna Huffington can park her Prius in her 9000 square foot home?

jkruse said...

Sure, let's consider the question. It's complicated, and I'm not going to come up with the answer. It may very well be that the best solution, from an environmental impact, may be to forgo the hybrid and drive a small, high tech diesel.

However, your statement that I was responding to implied that people who buy a hybrid are stupid to spend money on which they won't see a solid return. I was pointing out that for some of us, there are considerations beyond the financial bottom line that influence our actions.

You want to talk about subsidies? How about all the 'business owners' who deducted the full price of the Hummer they drove to the office?

Bike Bubba said...

OK, let's get rid of both subsidies, then.

And certainly some people will buy the technology whether it makes fiscal sense or not. That said, I would anticipate that this is only a minority of hybrid owners; if we ended tax subsidies and carpool lane privileges for hybrid owners, the market would shrink by 80% at least.

And thus we really ought to ask ourselves what opportunities we're missing because we're subsidizing hybrid cars to the tune of billions of dollars each year. Maybe a baby diesel that gets just as good of mileage without the toxic waste.

jroosh said...

If I could chime in here too...

Diesels are a great solution as long as the tree huggers don't choke (pun intended) the technology with overly-rigorous emissions standards.

As for hybrids, subsidies should be abolished on everything: Ethanol, Dairy, etc. We are ruining our country financially going into more and more debt spent on special interests.

I think most people buy Hybrids because they are either misinformed, can't do math, or are making a statement. There are admittedly some that do so to support the technology so that it can in fact be viable someday.

Interestingly, Honda's hybrid failed and was cancelled.


Was it because it wasn't as good as Toyota's? No.

It was because noone wanted a hybrid that wasn't differentiated enough in its styling from the conventional Accord.

Which is to say that many of these buyers (including the Hollywood wackos and Al Gore's dumbass progeny) buy these things not to help the environment, rather to feed their own egos or make a fashion statement.

That by the way is in fact why the Prius is so ugly. There is no other reason for it to be shaped the way it is.

It is meant to stick out like a sore thumb.

Bike Bubba said...

A road test by Paul & Anita Lienert of the Detroit News clocked the Accord hybrid in at an "impressive" 21mpg, slightly better than a Suburban. Odd to think that the same guys who made the Insight get to 70mpg dropped the ball when scaling it to a bigger vehicle.

(actually, I think they were trying to use the torque to make it perform a little more like a "clean conscience" Mustang)